My Comments on:

Jonathan Jarrett,

UK HE Suicide Pact: Cambridge first,



http://hnn.us/blogs/entries/137004.html (now) https://historynewsnetwork.org/blog/137004


HNN Cliopatria [pseudonym], Feb. 26, 2011

Andrew D. Todd


 a_d_todd@rowboats-sd-ca.com 

http://rowboats-sd-ca.com/




(My Responses)


(02/28/2011 03:56 PM)

Channeling

American out-of-state tuition is designed to  channel people, not to raise money.  Unless  you are  rich, or you  rate a merit-based  scholarship,  you go somewhere in-state. Most state universities have student bodies which are ninety or ninety-five percent in-state.  Admission standards are  higher out-of-state, as well. The two factors tend to coincide. There are very few places which are both expensive and easy to get into.

One  might add that in liberal arts departments, advanced graduate students can often  register de-facto full-time for  one or three hours, paying only a small fraction of what a law or  business student (MBA) would  pay. The university would prefer that people studied liberal arts, and if they  insist on studying law or business,  they are made to  pay extra for it. In the  western states, they have something called WICHE, organized by the  Western Governors' Conference.  So many western states only  have populations of a million or so, and cannot afford to  run the range of academic programs which a state  like Ohio or Illinois can. So they have a system of exemptions from out-of-state  tuition for people from the WICHE states for selected programs.  This  tends to be applied  to professional school programs, typically health-care-related,  rather than to liberal arts. The nature of the work is different, being  more  group-oriented. An advanced medical student might be registered for "the surgical clerkship," or "the obstetric clerkship," carrying sixteen credit hours, which works out to living  in  the hospital, assigned to a particular service, and being on call twenty-four hours a day, sleeping between cases. The curriculum being so structured, adjustments cannot  just be organized on an  ad-hoc basis. People who have good reasons for coming  in from out-of-state are given appropriate discounts. Programs like WICHE do not  mean, however, that  freshmen from, say, Idaho are allowed to go to school in South Dakota without the financial penalties  kicking in. 

Similarly, there  are tuition differentials between community colleges, state teachers' colleges, and  state universities, corresponding  to differences in admission requirements. In borderline cases, people are expected to start in community colleges (doing what would  be considered secondary school work in  Europe  or Japan). They can then move up to  state teachers' colleges, and  then go  on to universities.  The point of this is that  community colleges do not have fraternities. A certain combination of wealth and academic performance is required  to  go where  one could join a fraternity. To go within the reach of a fraternity, you have to demonstrate that either, a) you can afford to be a playboy, academically, financially, and socially, or b)  that you are of a sufficiently scholarly temperament not to be inclined to be a  playboy, and are impervious to the fraternity recruiters. There is a delicate balance-- fraternities are allowed to go so far, and no further, in recruiting their drinking schools.

Englishmen, being at a distance, tend to  miss  these kind of subtleties, and when they set out to create an "American Plan,"  they are apt to create a rigid bureaucratic monstrosity which no American would have created. That seems to be what is happening in England now.

About a year ago, I heard about something curious. It seemed that an English college was offering a course in wearing high-heels.  So I took  the trouble to track down the  references. It  turned out, on inquiry, that the college in  question was South Thames College, a "Further Education College" (FEC). This term will probably be instinctively familiar to Jonathan Jarrett, but to Americans at a distance, it takes a certain  amount of thought to get one's  brain around a FEC.

It seems that   a FEC is somewhere between an American vocational high school and an American community college, in other words, a community college  with a minimum entrance  age of sixteen instead of eighteen. I  gather a FEC is the  kind of place for  kids who didn't do  very well on  their  O-levels (now called GCSE's), taken at the age of sixteen. Looking at the South Thames College catalog, it seemed a good deal  grittier than an American community  college,  and much more relentless in the assumption that anyone with brains had been skimmed off and sent somewhere else. As I read through the catalog, I felt progressively depressed, thinking, "isn't there _anything_ these people do at more than a third-rate level?" An  American Vocational High School or Community  College tends to  have things, not necessarily academic, which it  does well.   Community colleges tend to deal in  practical skills at a high level. You can often learn to fly an  airplane at a community college, or drive an eighteen-wheeler truck, or  become a locomotive engineer, etc. Then there are  various kinds of mechanics' programs. In short, you can learn all  kinds of things  at a community college which a Harvard or Yale (or Oxford or Cambridge) liberal arts graduate would  not  have a clue about. It was  this sort of quality which seemed to be lacking  at South Thames College.

The business about the high heels turned  out to be a supplemental course, but the burden of it was  that the girl students were being officially informed that they were too stupid to get by on merit, so they would therefore have to learn vamp tricks as well. That seemed rather brutal.

http://idle.slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&type=story&sid=10/06/10/1623246

http://www.south-thames.ac.uk/Chapters/Courses.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Thames_College
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Further_education




(03/04/2011 10:26 AM)

American Community Colleges Are An Expression of Community.

In America, the social distinctions are less absolute. I got my undergraduate degrees (in Anthropology and Engineering), in the late seventies and early eighties, at the University of Cincinnati, where my father was a professor of Philosophy. As a  "faculty brat," I was entitled to take unlimited numbers of course and degrees, tuition-free, and it was taken for granted that I should enroll in something or other, every term, summers included. I did a lot of taking courses by way of exploration which I could not have done if I had been paying tuition.  After I had earned my first degree, in Anthropology, and was studying engineering, I  took liberal arts courses on an "audit," or  non-graded basis, so that I could depart without formalities if  the subject should prove not so interesting as it had  first appeared.  It was much the same principle as starting to read a book in the library without being required to finish it, let alone to write and submit a reading note.

The University of Cincinnati controlled all the state-funded higher eduction in the area ("French model"), including not  only the medical school, but also three or four community colleges. On a  couple of occasions, I wound up taking courses in the community colleges, and got to know something about them. I took some standard academic courses during the summers between high-school (a standard practice, one of the functions of the American community college is to provide suitable instruction for advanced high-school students, on a part-time basis), and met the kind of classmates who were, um,  synchronizing community college enrollment with the collection of unemployment insurance. Instead of everyone being in their socially assigned compartment (Sixth-Form college, FEC, etc.), there was a kind of cross-stratigraphy of age and ability.

On another level, when I had finished my second undergraduate degree, my engineering degree, and was waiting the better part of a year to get into graduate school, I went and enrolled in a course in woodworking in the University of Cincinnati's equivalent of an English "tech." This was a school known as the Ohio College of Applied Science (originally  known as the Ohio Mechanics Institute). OCAS  had a range of programs, from traditional crafts, such as woodworking, to styles of engineering only slightly less mathematical than those taught in the regular engineering school. One oddity was a nondegree program in  Fire Science, designed to prepare men for the  civil service examination for the ranks of Lieutenant and Captain in the city fire department. At any rate, when I first visited the woodworking shop, two things happened. First, I was greeted by a professor of French, who knew my father, and who was doing carpentry for his own amusement. Second, the shopmaster issued me with a piece of wood, a carpenter's plane, and a steel carpenter's square; and instructed me to plane the piece of wood perfectly flat. Perfectly, mind you. Cincinnati is a German-American town, originally shaped by the refugees from the  1848 revolution, and this was craftsmanship in the German manner.

This sort of "larger cohesion" was the sort of thing which seemed absent from the South Thames catalog.












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